Re: turkish accidental "eksik bakiye" missing in emmentaler font

[Hans Aberg]

On 27 Nov 2013, at 20:36, Keith OHara <address@hidden> wrote:

> On Wed, 27 Nov 2013 06:35:48 -0800, Hans Aberg <address@hidden> wrote:
> 
>> On 27 Nov 2013, at 04:37, Keith OHara <address@hidden> wrote:
>>> Philippe Ploquin <philippeploquin <at> neuf.fr> writes:
>>>> The accidental called "eksik bakiye" is missing in lilypond.
>>> Can anyone give a link to a reference image showing this accidental in use?
>> 
>> There is one at [1]. In LilyPond, it might be called 
>> accidentals.sharp.slash.stem. It is a diminished limma, lowered by a 
>> syntonic comma 81/80.
>> 
> 
> Thanks.  I added that link to the bug-tracker.
> I see no support there for 'eksik bakiye' being a limma flat by a comma, 
> though.  If you mean the 256/243 limma lowered by 80/81, that is not at all a 
> simple ratio, and would not seem to be an alteration that comes up in any 
> harmonic theory of music.

In the Ph.D. thesis by Ozan Yarman, "79-tone tuning & theory for Turkish maqam 
music", p. 90 (PDF 106), he mentions the “eksik bakiye” or "diminished limma" 
of AEU. Looking a bit further in the tables, AEU apparently uses Pythagorean 
limit only, that is 3-limit, and not 5-limit.

So it should be a Pythagorean comma, it seems, though in E53 approximations, 
the values become the same.

>> You might rewrite this file to refer to E53 as it properly should be, if 
>> Graham Breed’s regular.ly file is incorporated into LilyPond, using my 
>> regularE53.ly as a template, cf. thread “microtonal accidentals” on the 
>> development list.
>> 
> 
> We could include regular.ly in LilyPond if Graham wants that.  It does seem 
> to serve the community better at the microtonal website, where there is more 
> context for theory of tuning.

Some things did not work in the past, like key signatures, but it seems to have 
been fixed now. So that might make it better having it a part of the LilyPond 
distribution.

> 'makam.ly' can retune the scale for Turkish makam with one hard-coded line, 
> which might be more appropriate in this case.
> 
> (Notice that LilyPond's current makam.ly effectively uses the 54-ET system 
> mentioned a few posts lower in the link you gave.  I can't read Turkish, but 
> from the emoticons I suspect they are saying 53-ET fits the music better.)

In Turkish music, one uses E53. I think LilyPond has a hack dividing the E12 
major second into 9 parts, so it really should be E108.