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[DotGNU]test
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Norbert Bollow |
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[DotGNU]test |
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Fri, 29 Jun 2001 15:11:57 +0200 |
test message
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testing
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From: Grant Gross <address@hidden>
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Subject: [DotGNU]Story on Open Source/Free Software alternatives to .Net?
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Hi, all
Sorry to post this to the whole list -- I couldn't
find an individual email address to send this to.
I'm with NewsForge.com, the open source/free software
news site, and I'm working on a story about
alternatives to Microsoft's .Net. Would some here be
able to talk to me about the dotGNU project? It sounds
like exactly the right fit for this story.
Thanks,
Grant
=====
Grant Gross
managing editor
NewsForge.com
__________________________________________________
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Subject: [DotGNU]Re: .GNU
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> I am confused as to what you mean by DNS-like authentication
This may be a question for the DotGNU FAQ...
How does everyone like the following?
Q: In what ways is the DotGNU framework inspired by the DNS system?
A: In the DNS system, the information is stored in a non-centralized
manner all over the internet. Everyone is free to operate one or
more DNS servers. This is in strong contrast to Microsoft's
"Passport" system, where all authentication and personal
identify information is stored in servers controlled by Microsoft.
In the DotGNU system, everyone who wants can operate an
authentication/personal identity server, and all users can freely
choose which authentication/personal identity server(s) they
want to trust with their information.
Another very interesting aspect of the DNS system is how a high
degree of reliability can be achieved inexpensively by making
the same information available from several servers on
different network segments.
Greetings, Norbert.
--
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From: address@hidden (Myrddian)
Subject: [DotGNU]Testing my E-mail
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This is just a test to see if I can post or not 0_o?
--
__________________________________________
Myrddian <address@hidden(nospam)au>
-------------------------------------------
"I stayed up all night playing poker with tarot cards. I got a full house
and four people died".
-- Steven Wright
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From: address@hidden (Myrddian)
Subject: [DotGNU]Something to start with
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--zhXaljGHf11kAtnf
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Well I know some of us have been talking about implementation issues for this
project,
To start of I'll be posting on this mailing list everything I have written for
this project in the beginning
to some more recent times.
Although these are not concrete they are what I thought DotGNU would/will be.
I hope to write up a more formal document, the idea is that this final
document/proposal would be
formal detailed and is what everybody thinks this project will be.
I also hope that each person contributes this larger document. Note that this
document would be a technical
document specifying what DotGNU should be.
Any how these are just some silly ideas I have written down on text files, some
are more recent
but I'll post the older ones for completion.
Hope to hear your replies.....
--
__________________________________________
Myrddian <address@hidden(nospam)au>
-------------------------------------------
"I stayed up all night playing poker with tarot cards. I got a full house
and four people died".
-- Steven Wright
--zhXaljGHf11kAtnf
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Ok this is what I understand of .NET and Flurry.
So this list of details on what this project will try
to aim for will be based on what I have read so far, and what's available
from the M$ web site.
I might go off on tangents sometimes, but bear with me I only have this
in my head and it' very vague.
DotGNU will be a series of common API's (or Remote Objects) and services
which will allow remote access to data, or programs on remote systems.
It would be an Object Oriented based system, Independent on Language.
One limitation on .NET is that it's centralised, that is everything is tied
down to basically what MS provides in terms of services on their servers,
not to mention that most of .NET is closely tied to their OS's and their
products for deployment.
This makes MS the only sole .NET provider, people can write packages
which uses their platform, but everything is tied to their network
making the programmer use only one Enviroment (Windows)
Where DotGNU differs, is that it is a it's not a single network, rather a
series of networks with common API or Objects for information Exchange.
The information in exchange can be anything (like user data, or modify
documents from a remote location and have all machines tied in to those
changes).
But how does one tie the seperate server's and services provided by
DotGNU. This can be done by creating a Resource Locator (Borrowed from
Flurry, described as DRL) or something very similar to an URL.
.NET does this via Passport, but because everything in .NET is tied back
to MS running their own network this is not an acceptable way for DotGNU
to operate.
Flurry does it via something called DRL, however because Flurry is
primarily used for user info exchange (ie: transfer of user data) and
because .GNU is not just user informtaion exchange. However it's interesting
as a way we could implement our method of Server/Resource Location.
So what would .GNU consist of:
* Devices: Machine such as Pagers, Computers which can access the .GNU
Platform
* Development: Tools and API's which allow Developers to write .GNU
applications and servers.
* Servers: Servers which allow .GNU services to be hosted
and provide .GNU Objects for Transactions.
practically we should use current Free Software
projects to make a deployment quick and easy
allowing service Provides to move quickly.
* Client App: The Client application which utilise .GNU platform
* Identification: Resource locators only tell where resources are
However by making the Platform users have a
home server (ie: where verification lies) it can
use the resource locator to find verification of
the user.
Well I think this is enough mental giberrish, tell me what you think.
Modify it and send me feed back I need to know where I am wrong or
what should be modified,removed or added to the platform.
--zhXaljGHf11kAtnf
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DotGNU is an alternate platform and enviroment.
Its an enviroment because it will consists of a series of common API's (or
Remote Objects) and services,
which will allow transparent acces to data, programs on remote systems, and or
Web Services.
However it is a platform becasue application written for DotGNU will not have
to worry about, the host
they operate in (ie: OS, CPU, and other soft/hardware issues). In this it would
very similar to Java.
An example as to how its an enviroment, you can have a native application (ie:
GNU Emacs, native- referring compiled
to run under a certain OS and Hardware config) and yet have access to the
DotGNU Network Enviroment, by using API
calls to remote servers.
Another example, would be that of a platform, in that it can run program build
for .GNU with out having to worry
about the Host Machine configuration, ie: program built this way use byte code.
However unlike the Java Platform
DotGNU is not limited to one Language, and unlike .NET its not tied to one
specific OS.
DotGNU will also be a decentralised system. Unlike .NET and Hailstorm in which
both rely on central networks and
servers, this means that more than one service provider can exists for DotGNU.
So what would DotGNU consist of:
* Devices: Any device which can access the DotGNU platform or use the
DotGNU enviroment, this can be computers
Palmtop devices, etc.
* Devlopment: These are tool and API's which allow the programmer to write
DotGNU programs (tools such as GCC, GDB etc)
* Servers: These are applications which host the DotGNU platform, or run
DotGNU Services. The latter type provide
DotGNU Objects or Interfaces for Transactions (we should take
advantage of current Free Software
Projects, to make deployment quick and easy). The Former type of
server runs program compiled under the
DotGNU Byte-code on a host system.
* Client Apps: These refer to applications which use the DotGNU Network
platform to connect to services, which
can be in a local IntraNet or in the Internet.
* Applications: These refer to applications compiled unsing the DotGNU
byte-code model which requires a
server to correctly run
* Identification: Because DotGNU has no central base, a common method of
identification has to be
thought of. One method would be to copy the Uniform
Resource Locator format (URL)
to tell a server or application to verify the user. If
transactions or any form
of secure information is required to pass through DotGNU
this has to be implemented
DotGNU would be in theory Object Oriented, however to remain true to it's goal
of non-language dependancy, it will have
to provide trandional languages such as C standard C calls to access it.
Technologies involved and or Standard would involve
XML (such as XML-rpc, XML-HTTP, etc), Compoment Objects (Bonobo), Peer to Peer
communication.
So in short here a brief cap on what DotGNU is at the moment:
1. A language independet Platform (ie: support any language not one specific)
2. Usage of common Developement tools, to make the transition transparent
3. An independent platform (ie: like Java) of OS and Hardware configuration for
Programs
4. Usage of technologies such as XML, and Bonobo
5. De-centralised networks, tied in by a commond API, Objects for resource
location and transactions
6. In the future offer compatability with .NET, HailStorm and Flurry
7. Uses the GNU GPL
8. A series of Objects and Services, tied in by the Common API
Any comments? Questions? Additions you would like to see? Even Removals?
Hope to hear from you soon.
Enzo.
--zhXaljGHf11kAtnf
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DotGNU is an alternate platform and enviroment.
Its an enviroment because it will consists of a series of common API's (or
Remote Objects) and services,
which will allow transparent acces to data, programs on remote systems, and or
Web Services.
However it is a platform becasue application written for DotGNU will not have
to worry about, the host they operate in (ie: OS, CPU, and other soft/hardware
issues). In this it would very similar to Java.
An example as to how its an enviroment, you can have a native application (ie:
GNU Emacs, native- referring compiled to run under a certain OS and Hardware
config) and yet have access to the DotGNU Network Enviroment, by using API
calls to remote servers.
Another example, would be that of a platform, in that it can run program build
for .GNU with out having to worry about the Host Machine configuration, ie:
program built this way use byte code. However unlike the Java Platform DotGNU
is not limited to one Language .
DotGNU will also be a decentralised system. Unlike .NET and Hailstorm in which
both rely on central networks and servers, this means that more than one
service provider can exists for DotGNU.
XML (such as XML-rpc, XML-HTTP, etc), Compoment Objects (Bonobo), Peer to Peer
communication.
So in short here a brief cap on what DotGNU is at the moment:
1. A language independet Platform (ie: support any language not one specific)
2. Usage of common Developement tools, to make the transition transparent
3. An independent platform (ie: like Java) of OS and Hardware configuration for
Programs
4. Usage of technologies such as XML, and Bonobo
5. De-centralised networks, tied in by a commond API, Objects for resource
location and transactions
6. In the future offer compatability with .NET, HailStorm and Flurry
7. Uses the GNU GPL
8. A series of Objects and Services, tied in by the Common API
What it is not:
1.Not an .NET CLONE! It is not a Free implementation of .NET, yes it is
compatible with .NET, yes it can run .NET binaries. However people developing
for this platform should not use any .NET classes, the only reason they are
there is to make porting of .NET to .GNU easier.
2.DotGNU will not exclusively talk to .NET servers only, this will only happen
if the user, is using a .NET app on the Platform, otherwise this should not
happen
3.It is not a replacement for APACHE, XLM-RPC, Corba, Samba, GNU/Linux, BSD
4.No it is not just a ASP platform. It is more of a Distributed System
infrastructure, which one can build ASP, or any other form of Distributed
system on.
What is is:
1.A Platform in it's own right, that is people can write any programs on it,
and be cross-portable akin to Java, but unlike Java it supports multiple
Languages
2. There can be more than just one DotGNU server providing Services or Objects
for transactions or for calls. That is DotGNU will support a distributed
network using some sort of URL to located servers and resources (which the user
trusts)
3.It will provide compatability with .NET apps
4.Will provide GUI front ends (Probably using GNOME bindings)
5.Hopefully in the future allow some sort of 3D bindings
6. Uses some sort of hierachy (akin to DNS, to locate resources)
Objectives of this project:
To create a Compatible alternative to MS .NET while at the same time, try to
convert developers to the Free Software Paradigm, by providing a already usable
and stable inferstructure for Distributed systems wchih can readily share
information.
--zhXaljGHf11kAtnf
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This draft tries to specify the layers involved in this Project.
The idea is to use .NET bytecode. However due to .NET architecture
entire .NET compatability would be achaived until later stages.
The Layers of Abstraction:
Unlike .NET which uses COM and ActiveX components this Platform will try to
avoid using such
formats, however Component Objects are going to be an integral part of the
platform
DotGNU will consist of a series of Layers in, these are levels of abstraction
which describe
how the libraries and program relate to the host system.
Layer 0: System Libraries, these libraries are essential system libraries
such as glibc, msvcrt.dll, Xlib. These are the basic foundation
Libs which everything depends on.
Layer 1: Host/Native version of the DotGNU platform Libraries, These are
host dependant libs of DotGNU. They are complete, this allows native
programs of to access the DotGNU platform. These are not Portable.
Layer 2: Byte Code link Lib, these libs are Byte Code linker libraries which
link the calls from the byte code program to the Native layer 1 libs
These are not entirely Byte code. That is they contain extra
information
as to what native libs they translate the calls to. These are not
portable
Layer 3: Custom Libs, these are custom Byte code libs which the user might
distribute
They might be, Static, Shared or Dynamically loaded. Compiled using
the
DotGNU Byte Code they are fully portable accross platforms.
Layer 4: Server Program. This refers to the Server programs running using the
DotGNU
Platform.
Layer 5: Client Side Programs. By using Layers 3 and 4 we could implement
some sort of Active X components, thus making this .NET compatible
NOTE: This is just a draft and just mental outburst, please feel free to add
remove or change this :)
Myrddian
--zhXaljGHf11kAtnf--
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Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 09:38:14 +0200
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From: Norbert Bollow <address@hidden>
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> Any how these are just some silly ideas I have written down on
> text files, some are more recent but I'll post the older ones
> for completion.
Myrddian,
please don't call this "silly ideas". I think they're very
good.
One important question I have is, how do we get there? The
whole project is pretty big. I would like to see a DotGNU
alternative to Microsoft's "Password" very soon.
You say that it will be possible to execute compiled Byte Code on
any DotGNU platform. This means that when the Byte Code format
is changed/improved, the DotGNU platform must be able to execute
old formats as well as the current one. Also the DotGNU platform
should be able to execute whatever bytecode formats Microsoft uses
for .NET -- now since several different bytecode formats must be
supported anyway, why not also support Java bytecode, and
implement that part first?
I think that could allow to greatly reduce the necessary amount
of development time for getting to the point where a first
stable and useful version of DotGNU can be released.
Greetings, Norbert.
--
Norbert Bollow, Weidlistr.18, CH-8624 Gruet (near Zurich, Switzerland)
Your own domain with all your Mailman lists: $15/month http://cisto.com
Business Coaching for Internet Entrepreneurs ---> http://thinkcoach.com
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Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 12:31:23 +0200
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From: Norbert Bollow <address@hidden>
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Subject: [DotGNU]dotgnu.org website (was Re: .GNU)
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address@hidden wrote:
> I can start construction of a site and link it up with a SourceForge account
> for the mailing lists and CVS repository... What are you thinking more
> specifically? I am ready to work.
I was not thinking of a technically sophisticated
website... just a place on the web where you can always find
consistent, coherent information on the current state of the
DotGNU vision.
Greetings, Norbert.
--
Norbert Bollow, Weidlistr.18, CH-8624 Gruet (near Zurich, Switzerland)
Your own domain with all your Mailman lists: $15/month http://cisto.com
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Tel +41 1 972 20 59 Fax +41 1 972 20 69 address@hidden
From address@hidden Thu Jul 5 18:15:12 EDT 2001
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From: address@hidden (Myrddian)
Subject: [DotGNU]Source Forge?
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Well I think I mentioned it last time that I have a SourceForge ready site for
DotGNU, if it's
needed....
So if anybody want to add themselves there please do so.... oh by the way I've
never used SourceForge
before... so if another person also want to admin it, while I get the ropes
(which should not be long
looks pretty simple).
So just look for DotGNU on SOurce Forge..... Any body here a good web site
person? We could start of with
some info.
Any how see you all later
__________________________________________
Myrddian <address@hidden(nospam)au>
-------------------------------------------
"I stayed up all night playing poker with tarot cards. I got a full house
and four people died".
-- Steven Wright
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