Re: Lisp files that load cl-lib in problematical ways

[Björn Bidar]

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:

>> From: Björn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@thaodan.de>
>> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>,  Gregory Heytings <gregory@heytings.org>,
>>   rms@gnu.org,  emacs-devel@gnu.org
>> Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2023 11:10:06 +0300
>> 
>> Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@gmail.com> writes:
>> 
>> > Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
>> >
>> >> Preloading unnecessary stuff is a slippery slope that once we start
>> >> there's no way of knowing where we end.  So let's not.
>> >
>> > AFAIK, the main drawback is increased memory consumption.  The main
>> > benefit is that Emacs starts faster.
>> 
>> About how much memory are we talking here? All this sounds like talk
>>  about micro optimizations.
>
> If we ignore such "micro optimizations", we will quickly bloat Emacs,
> since those small amounts add up.  We have a lot of relatively small
> potential additions that we make a point of not adding, because if we
> decide adding one is okay, then why not add all the rest?  We don't
> add such stuff to subr.el or to simple.el or to files.el, and keep
> them separate, precisely because adding them all will not be
> insignificant.

I get that point but in this case we talk about doing something
slightly different to not load cl-lib while eventually cl-lib is loaded
anyway.

>
>> Emacs speed is more limited about it being single threaded most of the
>>  time than anything else.
>
> I don't see the relevance, sorry.  We can work on making Emacs faster
> without bloating it.

>From my pov Emacs start up time or speed is more limted by Emacs being
single threaded rather than loading a few kbs of code that will be
loaded later anyway.