Re: [Fenfire-dev] Re: [vos-d] a 3D interface vision

[Alatalo Toni]

On Thu, 23 Oct 2003, Tuomas Lukka wrote:

> My point is that with a limited-resolution display, and with a mouse and 
> keyboard,
> 3D interfaces just don't make sense - the "feeling of space" you talk about
> just doesn't happen. .

yet, in the end, the visual objects in (your) libvob, as they are rendered
with OpenGL, are assigned positions in a 3D coordinate system and appear
on the screen accordingly. i mean, they have 2d position, and size and
order according to z-distance. or? and the rendering depends on zoom etc.

just that their behaviour (movements etc.) is via different underlying
(2d?) coordsysses, right? that is: not bound to a single 3d coordsys.
Peter's counterargument in his reply that i haven't replied to yet about
the familiarity -> intuitivity of mimicing the real world .. hm .. perhaps
your arguments about the lack of intuitive control devices (eg the body :)
and about the restrictions of real-like 3d i tried to discuss in that
lengthy post outweigh that.  of course it depends on the task, as Peter
noted there, and as Tuomas has acknowledged for e.g. games (where making
things (e.g. navigating) artificially difficult can be part of gameplay).

however, there is *some* feeling of space, certainly in realistic 3d games
(though not at all like in the real world with these devices, agreed) but
also in the abstract 2 / pseudo-3d infospaces you developed in gzigzag and
perhaps now in Fenfire too -- where it could perhaps be further developed
(i remember Tuukka or someone wondering about sense of space when thinking
about the Loom views)

then again, there is also the question what we should do when immersive
hi-res displays and datasuites/gloves etc. are available (this is
interesting for Kyperjokki as we work on installations there) -- though i
do find the emphasis on commodity hardware (desktop PCs, legos :) in
Fenfire right (both ideologically and practically for myself)

>       Tuomas

~Toni