Re: [Paparazzi-devel] Paparazzi center ans CGS for Windows

[Meier Lorenz]

Given that I'm the QGC main developer I'm clearly biased regarding it, so I 
won't give any advice on that - download it and try the simulation and see for 
yourself:


https://github.com/mavlink/v10release/downloads
http://qgroundcontrol.org/dev/build_source

Regarding MAVLink I have a stronger opinion, given that it has been adopted by 
quite a few projects I believe it is in a sweet spot between being relatively 
simple, yet powerful enough to cover most needs. We're working currently on a 
few high-level features like the mission library, but these are optional parts, 
the core protocol is pretty easy to adopt.

With an aerial middleware (MAVConn), a ROS bridge and a Python interface and 
graphing tool (Andrew Tridgell's excellent pyMAVLink) it also has a reasonable 
Ecosystem beyond just the onboard C implementation and the available GCS.


On Oct 6, 2011, at 6:38 PM, Rui Costa wrote:



The best solution now will be to adapt the QGroundControl and MavLink, right?



Cheers
Rui Costa

On Thu, Oct 6, 2011 at 4:31 PM, Rui Costa 
<address@hidden<mailto:address@hidden>> wrote:
Thnk you Lorenz for your great opinion. It's a good help.


I would like to improve the actual paparazzi GCS, but I don't know how to do it 
and don't understand the actual language.

It would be nice to improve some things on the GCS. Is there anyone working on 
that? Maybe we can join a comission to see what can be improved and work 
together to archieve that.



Cheers
Rui Costa





On Thu, Oct 6, 2011 at 4:24 PM, Meier Lorenz 
<address@hidden<mailto:address@hidden>> wrote:
One comment on that. I have an OpenPilot board sitting here and know the 
onboard and offboard codebase at least ok, if not well. Its a great project and 
I'm happily using it.


However: OpenPilot has a kind of "shared memory" architecture between GCS and 
autopilot.

If you change an onboard data object in only one variable -> Complete re-build 
of the GCS

This approach works nicely for OpenPilot. It is however about the worst-case 
for a multi-project use of the GCS, since it effectively forces you to use the 
very same data containers. And since the data containers are even used on the 
UI level, changing the protocol forces you to update the UI code.

The difference between QGroundControl/MAVLink and OpenPilot is that MAVLink and 
QGC have one abstraction layer on each the autopilot and the GCS side. So the 
user interface can be changed without effects and the onboard code can be 
changed without side-effects. OpenPilot misses these layers in the onboard code 
and in the GCS.
So it is very elegant for a single project. But its the opposite of 
standardized communication - I've even added MAVLink support for the OP board 
I'm using for this reason.

So don't take me wrong, nothing against OpenPilot, I'm happily running a board 
with OP on it and I'm partly using the GCS. But for a multi-project use, this 
is a dead end.


Please also note that the OP GCS has a weak mission support (I haven't seen a 
waypoint list at all so far), so I'm not sure how this will work out for the 
very advanced concepts the PPZ community is used to. Other GCS like APM 
Planner, HK GCS or QGC are also not on the PPZ versatility level, but they at 
least support takeoff / landing / loiter waypoints and actions like relay 
firing, with more MAV_CMDs to come:
MAV_CMD reference: http://pixhawk.ethz.ch/wiki/mavlink/

And on a personal note: I really think there is a need for a standardized, open 
and not project-owned protocol out there. APM and Pixhawk are already sharing 
MAVLink and with QGroundcontrol, APM Planner and HK GCS there are several 
options available (QGC runs on all three OS, APM Planner on Win and Linux if I 
remember correctly).
And there is even Android support: 
http://diydrones.com/profiles/blogs/copter-gcs-with-mission-support-and-more.

After Paparazzi strived for openness so long it would be sad to see this 
opportunity pass to really have joint protocol in the community.


Cheers,
Lorenz


On Oct 6, 2011, at 5:48 PM, Rui Costa wrote:

I would like to have your feedback about the ideia of modifying the openpilot 
GCS software to work with paparazzi boards.

We have the authorization from openpilot people to do it.

It's an highly customizing platform and appears to be easy to work. Almost 
everything is in C++ language.

It can work on linux, windows or MAC OS and permits to create installation 
files. So, it's very userfriendly for some end users.


What you think?

http://wiki.openpilot.org/display/Doc/Ground+Control+Station+User+Manual



Cheers
Rui Costa





On Mon, Sep 19, 2011 at 4:38 PM, Rui Costa 
<address@hidden<mailto:address@hidden><mailto:address@hidden<mailto:address@hidden>>>
 wrote:
Hi again,

Just to correct the link:

www.openpilot.org<http://www.openpilot.org/><http://www.openpilot.org/>




Cheers
Rui Costa




On Mon, Sep 19, 2011 at 3:23 PM, Rui Costa 
<address@hidden<mailto:address@hidden><mailto:address@hidden<mailto:address@hidden>>>
 wrote:
Hello Bernard,


How is the paparazzi center for Windows?

Did you saw the CGS of 
openpilot.com<http://openpilot.com/><http://openpilot.com/> project?

www.openpilot.com<http://www.openpilot.com/><http://www.openpilot.com/>


I tried and it's so user friendly and it's great for the end users. It would be 
very nice to do something like that.

I can help. What you think? Have something working on windows right now?

The openpilot CGS is C++ language.


Best regards
Rui Costa


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Bernard Davison 
<address@hidden<mailto:address@hidden><mailto:address@hidden<mailto:address@hidden>>>
Date: Wed, Jul 27, 2011 at 7:42 AM
Subject: Re: [Paparazzi-devel] Paparazzi center ans CGS for Windows
To: 
address@hidden<mailto:address@hidden><mailto:address@hidden<mailto:address@hidden>>


The development process has started and the documentation also started but I 
haven't got as far as Eric yet.
I've been stuck on some other tasks but should be back onto it in a week or two 
tops.
Keep an eye on http://paparazzi.enac.fr/wiki/Installation/Windows

Note that I would not recommend anyone follow the instructions unless they want 
to help out Eric and I in making the system work.

Cheers,
Bernie.

Bernard Davison

Web: 
http://www.gondwana.com.au<http://www.gondwana.com.au/><http://www.gondwana.com.au/>
Mobile: 0412 039 128
Skype: rbdavison

Sponsor my Oxfam 
Trailwalker<http://trailwalker.oxfam.org.au/sydney/teams/team/?team_id=9819> 
team.




On 26/07/2011, at 11:11 PM, Rui Costa wrote:

Hello,


Any news about the development of the Paparazzi center and CGS software for 
Windows?



Best regards
Rui Costa
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------------------------------------------------------
Lorenz Meier
PhD Student
Computer Vision and Geometry Lab
ETH Zurich /
Swiss Federal Institute of Technology
http://www.inf.ethz.ch/personal/lomeier/


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------------------------------------------------------
Lorenz Meier
PhD Student
Computer Vision and Geometry Lab
ETH Zurich /
Swiss Federal Institute of Technology
http://www.inf.ethz.ch/personal/lomeier/