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Re: [PATCH 0/2] vmgenid: add generation counter


From: Chalios, Babis
Subject: Re: [PATCH 0/2] vmgenid: add generation counter
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2022 15:31:15 +0200
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On 4/8/22 12:17, Chalios, Babis wrote:


On 4/8/22 12:02, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote:
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On Thu, Aug 04, 2022 at 11:54:05AM +0200, Chalios, Babis wrote:
Hi Daniel,

On 3/8/22 18:26, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote:
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On Wed, Aug 03, 2022 at 03:41:45PM +0200, bchalios@amazon.es wrote:
From: Babis Chalios <bchalios@amazon.es>

VM generation ID exposes a GUID inside the VM which changes every time a
VM restore is happening. Typically, this GUID is used by the guest
kernel to re-seed its internal PRNG. As a result, this value cannot be exposed in guest user-space as a notification mechanism for VM restore
events.

This patch set extends vmgenid to introduce a 32 bits generation counter whose purpose is to be used as a VM restore notification mechanism for
the guest user-space.

It is true that such a counter could be implemented entirely by the
guest kernel, but this would rely on the vmgenid ACPI notification to
trigger the counter update, which is inherently racy. Exposing this
through the monitor allows the updated value to be in-place before
resuming the vcpus, so interested user-space code can (atomically)
observe the update without relying on the ACPI notification.
The VM generation ID feature in QEMU is implementing a spec defined
by Microsoft. It is implemented in HyperV, VMWare, QEMU and possibly
more. This series is proposing a QEMU specific variant, which means
Linux running on all these other hypervisor platforms won't benefit
from the change. If the counter were provided entirely in the guest
kernel, then it works across all hypervisors.

It feels like the kernel ought to provide an implementation itself
as a starting point, with this QEMU change merely being an optional
enhancement to close the race window.

Ideally there would be someone at Microsoft we could connect with to
propose they include this feature in a VM Gen ID spec update, but I
don't personally know who to contact about that kind of thing. A
spec update would increase chances that this change gets provieded
across all hypervisors.
You are right, this *is* out-of-spec. The approach here is based on various
discussions happened last year when we first tried to upstream and more
recently when vmgenid landed in Linux. I find that this summary:
https://lkml.org/lkml/2022/3/1/693 quite to the point. (CCing Jason to
have his take on the matter).

This series comes together with a Linux counterpart:
https://lkml.org/lkml/2022/8/3/563, where the generation counter is
exposed to user-space as a misc device. There, I tried to make the
generation counter "optional", in the sense that if it is not there, the
ACPI device should not fail, exactly because, for the moment, this is
not in the spec and hypervisors might not want to implement it.

However, I think that changing the spec will take time and this is a
real issue affecting real use-cases, so we should start from somewhere.
I know a spec change can take time, but has there even been any effort
at all to try to start that action since first discussed a year ago ?

These patch-sets are out exactly for starting the conversation on adding
this to the spec. As you mentioned, it would be great if we could get the
opinion of someone at Microsoft on this.


If these race condition issues are supposedly so serious that we need
to do this without waiting for a spec, then what is the answer for the
masses of users running Linux on VMware or HyperV/Azure ?

The problem arises when you start snapshotting and restoring on VMs,
so not everyone is affected from the issue. Use-cases interested in this
are ones that manage fleets of VMs that run code that relies on
user/kernel-space PRNGs or network-facing services using UUIDs, for
example.


With regards,
Daniel
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Cheers,
Babis

I am CCing Michael from Microsoft. Maybe he has some input on this.
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