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Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text
From: |
David Kastrup |
Subject: |
Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text |
Date: |
Tue, 26 Oct 2004 11:25:01 +0200 |
User-agent: |
Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/21.3.50 (gnu/linux) |
address@hidden (Kim F. Storm) writes:
> Stefan Monnier <address@hidden> writes:
>
>>> If the time stamps for the clicks indeed come from the X server,
>>> then Kim's timed scheme would probably not be very susceptible to
>>> system load/traffic congestion effects.
>>
>> The problm with it is that it goes against what we're trying to do,
>> which is to get Emacs's UI in line with "what non-Emacs users
>> expect". I.e. such users will just do a simple click and expect it
>> to follow the link.
>
> Yes, that's what we are trying to achieve -- the fundamental problem
> we discuss here is actually how to recognize when the stuff is a
> link and when it is something else which has a mouse-face property.
>
> In the examples given until now, the non-links have the mouse-face
> on an overlay -- so maybe to fix would be to only follow link which
> have the mouse-face as a text property in the buffer.
It does not make sense to introduce an arbitrary inconsistency because
this would fix a problem with an arbitrary example that just happens
to exist with that sort of implementation by chance instead of
design. If we can come up with a useful strategy that has a
reasonable chance of not breaking more than it fixes, then
preview-latex will be the one that has to adapt. But just because
preview-latex is an example where things will break does not mean that
it is the only possible one.
> If we can safely differentiate between links and non-links I think a
> short click should follow the link (double-clicks typically don't
> make sense there anyway) and a long click should set point
Well, I happen to disagree, since following a link is the more time
consuming action, anyway, and people might be tempted to press until
the browser window appears.
In any case, neither option is the behavior that a user would guess
without being explicitly introduced to it. So we need to turn it off
by default, or give an explanatory message of some kind by default.
> Appended is a patch which uses get-text-property rather than
> get-char-property to ignore overlay mouse-face properties.
I firmly object to such a course. While we should not let ourselves
be influenced too much by that, with XEmacs there is not even a
distinction between overlays and text properties. The choice between
the two when using Emacs should depend _exclusively_ on whether you
need the association with the text or the buffer, and not on any
chance side effects introduced to accidentally work with some package.
>> And if you add to the equation the extra code and conceptual
>> complexity of using timing-dependent information, I find it ends up
>> a loser.
>
> I don't really want to add any message there -- if we leave the
> feature disabled by default, the users who turn it on doesn't need
> to be told how to get the alternative behaviour.
>
> If we turn on the feature by default, there should at least be some
> way to disable that message.
Sure.
--
David Kastrup, Kriemhildstr. 15, 44793 Bochum
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, (continued)
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, Stefan, 2004/10/24
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, David Kastrup, 2004/10/25
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, Stefan, 2004/10/25
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, David Kastrup, 2004/10/25
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, Stefan Monnier, 2004/10/25
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, Ralf Angeli, 2004/10/25
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, Stefan Monnier, 2004/10/25
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, David Kastrup, 2004/10/25
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, Stefan Monnier, 2004/10/25
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, Kim F. Storm, 2004/10/26
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text,
David Kastrup <=
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, Kim F. Storm, 2004/10/26
- RE: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, Drew Adams, 2004/10/26
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, David Kastrup, 2004/10/26
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, Kim F. Storm, 2004/10/26
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, Luc Teirlinck, 2004/10/26
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, Kim F. Storm, 2004/10/27
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, Luc Teirlinck, 2004/10/27
- Re: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text, David Kastrup, 2004/10/27
- feature freeze (was: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text), Reiner Steib, 2004/10/27
- Re: feature freeze (was: finger-pointer curser as default for mouse-face text), Kim F. Storm, 2004/10/27