[Gnu-arch-users] Re: the dangers of no reply-to munging; Xouvert update

[Miles Bader]

Jonathan Walther <address@hidden> writes:
> Not everyone uses mutt.  Pine, elm, Eudora, even Outlook Express are
> common mail clients, and none of them have a concept of "group reply".
> Email is one of those things that should "just work".

If you munge Reply-To things don't `just work.'  If they did, I
wouldn't be arguing.

Munging Reply-To mucks with headers in a way that can make them
inconsistent:

If a sender specifies their own Reply-To header (like I do), then either
(1) it gets smashed by the list's Reply-To, and private replies go to
the wrong place, or (2) the list manager is smart and _doesn't_ munge
existing Reply-Tos -- just fine right?  Nope.  If that happens, then
people on the list get used to the majority of Reply-Tos being munged,
and so they get into the habit of always hitting `r' or whatever; if
they then want to followup to me, then the reply goes to the wrong
place, exactly the problem you said you just solved.

That's the real problem -- enough lists do this munging that many people
have come to expect it, and get confused when they see a list that
doesn't do it; like a giant ball of sticky hair, this practice has
grown, spurred on the the ignorance of users and list-masters alike.

However that doesn't change the fact that doing it breaks the headers.

> Remember TCP supplanted the "official" OSI standard networking
> protocols.

That's a silly argument (besides the fact that TCP _preceded_ the OSI
stuff) -- TCP _works_, and works well, that's why it won.  Reply-To
munging, on the other hand, works kind of, some of the time, and
persists mainly because people are stupid and software is broken.

> I want email to just work.

Me too.  But Reply-To munging ain't going to do it.

God I can't believe I'm having this argument.  Please people just bind
`r' to `reply-to-all', then things will work.  If you're using a stupid
mail program, switch to something better.  That's probably too much to
ask on the lynrd-skynrd mailing list, but surely gnu-arch-users is a bit
higher-brow?

-Miles
-- 
Somebody has to do something, and it's just incredibly pathetic that it
has to be us.  -- Jerry Garcia